http://www.thejournal.ie/religious-groups-child-abuse-compensation-3280100-Mar2017/#comment-6060722

[robert]

Robert Survivor Artane4y

1min ago

Minister Quinn you claimed the religious have a moral obligation to the tax payer but what you failed terribly in is that you covered up the truth children young children at that we not part of the redress deal 2002 for education this publicity stunt you are pulling again is damageing to survivors of your abuse you stoob up before the Irish people whos families you sir admitted abusing out loud and very perswasive you demanded that we be treated fairly yet you Minister Quinn have his the truth by your own office that blocked yet again survivors young children from the equality as their older brothers and sisters recevied as education development and skills funds you know you absalutly know Minister you BLOCKED YOUNG DEPENDANTS FROM THIS FUND that EARNS the Government 23 % of each survivor who is supposed to get 15,000 in total but you fail to say that you knew that survivors were foced to work hard labour without pay no wages still for the work children and women had to do no pensions for them either and no care for them at all all these are not benefits Minister no they are wages and pensions way way over due to the very tax payer you mention to claw back redress as you showed no mercy in robbing survivors and their tax paying families of their compensation . this Caranua fund is misily mean and insulting each and every survivor, riddled in Properganda as you Bully survivors out of their needs by guidelines that they are now accused of frauding from thei own money you are clawing back also.
to prove you are interested in the tax payer will you return the taxes charged for the goods in the guidlies you set up? NO did’ent thinks so just like you refused to hold a National Meeting that even your CEO refused a Reporter to come into a caranua meeting she was setting up, she threatened to walk if the reporter entered WHY MINISTER? what is it with you ?. The VERY CEO who was a CEO / Director over the ST STEPHENS TRUST along with the RIGHT of PLACE the Very Group you referred to to open this fund you were all in this corrution together please MR Quinn go away you hurt our Familie syet again and deprived the children of uch need education funds.
We the Survivors now DEMAND WAGES and PENSIONS for all the HARD WORK WE WERE FORCED TO DO and the SAME PRIVATE CARE THE CLERGY GOT AND GET ALSO WE WERE WOrKErS TOO WE DID THEIR HARD WORK or is SLAVERY OF CHILDREN AND WOMEN A IRISH GOVERNMENT POLICY RUN BY THE LABOUR PARTY? MR R QUINN YOU SIR DECIVED THE IRISH PEOPLE FAR TOO LONG the 50 50 deal is a SHAM a THEFT of MUCH NEEDED RESOURSES for the IRISH FAMILIES YOUR GOVERNMENT DESTrOYED AFETR ALL YOU SHOUTED THIS TO THE ROOF TOPS BEFORE YOU WERE A MINISTER but as soon as you got IN POWER YOU AS USUAL WITH LABOUR SHOWED YOUR TRUE COLOURS RED. BLOOD THIRTY PARTY PLEASE GO AWAY YOU ARE NOT TO BE TRUSTED AT ALL YOU COULD NOT EVEN MENTION THE 500,000 YOU SAVED AND THE PROJECT YOU PAIDYOUR PALS WHO IS GOING TO PAY THE [ROTYPE? OH YES THE SAME TAX PAYER. YOU ARE A JOKE AN INSULT TO ALL WHO ARE SUFFERING THE ABUSE FROM YOUR CEO ON THE RADIO YOU BOTH SHOWED YOUR TRUE COLOURS . GET OUT MINISTER BECAUSE YOU HAVE JUST CREATED A NEW LAW IN IRELAND, THAT BEING TWO CRIMINALS CAN CONVERSE AND IN SECRET CALL AN INDEMNITY AGREEMENT TO PAY 50 50 OR DO 50 50 OF THE TIME FOR THE SAME CRIMES ARE WE RIGHT ?
BY THE WAY IT WAS NOT 4,5000 PER SURVIVOR AS IT WAS SAID BY YOUR CEO IT WAS SECRETLY PUT 31 PEOPLE GOT 50 TO 110,000 EACH WHY MINISTER R QUINN WE FOUND THIS OUT THEN THE REVIEW SURVIVORS WERE TO GET 15,000 EACH BUTTHEN AGAIN MINISTER YOUR PARTY GOT 3,450 back in Taxes Your Religious God only knows how much 23% of 50 to 110,000 was your party got back there ssssssh did you say NOMr R QUINN Irish Politics is full of this NONSENSE where honest Politicians have to stay quiet. IT WAS NO WONDEr YOU ACCUSED THE SURVIVORS of being addicts and would use this money for those addictions huh shame you never published the group you referred to as a survivor Groups was the very same Group you paid who were full of alcoholics and being funded by the st stephens trust fund at the time. THIS HAS TO STOP MR R QUINN YOU OSULLIVAN AND BRUTON ALL THE SAME PEES IN A POD NO HEART FOR YOUNG CHILDREN as you started your cronie speach on the RYAN rEPOrT YOU BrOKe THAT LAW TOO BY ADDReSSING THE PUBLIC as FOLLOWS ” We can redress their childrens children their children and their childrens children MR R QUINN YOU SIR BLOCKED ALL YOUNG CHILDREN FROM ALL EDUCATION FUNDS, you picked on my childhood how dare you but tto insult my Family once again i will fight you and your most decietful ways

[Rob Northall]

The Article this comment is from is repeated  bellow

'Hand over the keys': Pressure builds on religious groups over child abuse reparations

The religious groups say falling property prices are the reason only 14% of the total costs have been paid.

Mar 10th 2017, 9:32 AM 14,603

I don’t want to see them bankrupted. They could solve this issue honourably and with dignity by handing over the keys to the properties used for educational purposes to the Irish government, to the Irish people.

[It would be] as a public token of their remorse and their sympathy with the victims and the relatives of the victims of this terrible period in Irish history.

THAT’S WHAT FORMER education minister Ruairi Quinn said today in response to a report that shows less than 14% of the total costs of the child abuse scandal has been paid by religious institutions.

The Artane Boys Industrial School, now called St David's, which was run by the Christian Brothers and was named in the Commission to Inquire into Child Abuse Report.

The Christian Brothers and the Sisters of Mercy, meanwhile, have defended the amounts they’ve paid in compensation for child abuse and investigation costs after coming under fire because of the contents of the report by the Comptroller & Auditor General, published yesterday.

The report showed that €209 million had been paid by religious institutions for their role in institutional child abuse. Current costs to the State – including an inquiry, a survivor redress scheme and related survivor supports - add up to €1.5 billion.

But because of the fall in the value of properties used as payment to the state, as well as the rising costs of the inquiry, the religious institutions responsible aren’t paying half anymore, and the State no longer has the legal authority to change the amount because of a deal made back in 2002.

Current education minister Richard Bruton said that they were now looking to put “moral pressure” onto religious institutions to pay and donate to the state as a gesture of goodwill and moral leadership.

The Christian Brothers

Source: Leon Farrell/Photocall Ireland

But the Christian Brothers said that these figures were 14 months old, and don’t account for more recent compensation amounts, with their estimation of what they’ve contributed equalling €615 million.

In a statement they said:

“The Comptroller & Auditor General report predates significant payments by the Congregation. Of the €34 million cash pledge, €24 million has been honoured with the final €10million being paid on a phased basis in 2017 linked to property sales.”

Sisters of Mercy

The Sisters of Mercy have said that they’ve honoured all of their commits and have “contributed property and cash measured in the sum of €33,091,114 pursuant to the Indemnity Agreement of 2001″.

Following the publication of the Ryan Report the Congregation committed to making an additional contribution which in December 2009 was valued at €117,506,800 composed as follows:

• To Cara Nua, the independent trust for former residents: the sum of €20,000,000 cash plus properties then worth €11,590,000.• To the State: properties then worth €80,856,800.• To the voluntary sector: properties then worth €15,060,000.

But the financial downturn eroded the value of the properties to the State, according to the Sisters of Mercy. They say that part of the deal was that the value of their contribution would be subject to the price fluctuation of individual properties.

Ruairi Quinn

Source: Mark Stedman/Photocall Ireland

On Morning Ireland today, former education minister Ruairi Quinn said that the Christian Brothers controlled many of the schools, as do many of the other religious teaching orders.

“And they are answerable only to themselves and to the head of their organisation, usually someone based in Rome. And in turn that person is answerable only to the Pope.

I don’t see any sense of movement or engagement or responsibility coming from Pope Francis in relation to this matter.

He said that the historical scandal involved both the state and the religious teaching orders, but it was the taxpayer who had borne the bulk of the payments.

“The taxpayer has now compensated those people, those victims, to the tune of €1.6 billion [in terms of round figures]. The taxpayer has now compensated those people and it has cost you and me and everybody else €1.6 billion at a time when that money could have been used in so many different ways.

That’s a far cry from the 50/50 deal that everybody wanted… and it’s a far-cry from what the religious orders promised themselves.

Richard Bruton

Although the current education minister, Richard Bruton, acknowledged that the Christian Brothers were making scheduled payments as agreed, he said there was an ‘issue about taking responsibility of the sexual abuse that was endemic’.

It’s moral pressure that we seek to exercise: we can’t force them to do anything.

“The Church provide moral leadership, and people in the Church will be disappointed they’re not living up to their own [standards].”

“The Church should be honouring their responsibilities.”

He admitted that the State carried much of the blame as well, as it sent children to these institutions and inspected these schools, and said that the State bore 50% of the responsibility.

Source - http://www.thejournal.ie/religious-groups-child-abuse-compensation-...

[micheal]

Quinn is a complete Muppet in a meeting with the orders he agreed with them that they DIDN'T carry out most of the abuse so there in lay's the toxic foundations of caranua.

[Martin Woodland]

GROUND HOG DAY, NOTHING CHANGES.

[jack colleton]

Are Survivors Of State And Church Abuse Not "Tax Payers"? 

[jack colleton]

Not Tax Payers Because Denied An Education?  Not Tax Payers Because Out Of Work Due To The Effects Of Abuse By The State And The Church (Hand In Glove)? 

[jack colleton]

50 %  State Abuse?

50 %  Church Abuse?

[micheal]

Quinn the lying fuck believed along with the orders that most of the abuse was carried out by victims families we was dumb enough to put that in the summary minutes of a meeting between him and the orders, that is what the orders still believe.

[micheal]

He not we ffs

[micheal]

had a long tradition of acting in the public good. Any future contributions or property
transfers should be seen in the same light.
Br Francis Manning, De La Salle Brothers, said that he was struggling to understand
what “fair and reasonable” meant in this context and wondered how small congregations
could be treated on the same basis as the Government in terms of assets.
Fr Pat Lucey, Dominicans, noted that his Congregation could accept the 50:50
principle, though he could not speak for any other congregation. He felt that this and
other meetings were positive and that the Minister’s comments gave food for thought to
all attendees.
Sr Mary Christian, Sisters of Charity, Welcomed discussions but noted that she
would have to go back to her congregation. Expressed concern that media was
portraying congregations as being 100% responsible for the abuse perpetrated in
institutions.
Sr Anne Kavanagh, Sisters of St Louis, enquired if the names of other management
bodies would be published.
6. The Minister made further comments in response to the contributions from the
congregational representatives, as follows:
• He noted that the publication of the Ryan Report in 2009 transformed public
opinion. He stressed that if the 50:50 principle could be agreed then discussions
could begin on how that might be achieved.
• The individuality of congregations would be fully respected and there was no
question of the confiscation of assets.
• Legal advice would be obtained in relation to the apportionment issue and if that
permitted the Redress Board providing figures then it would be possible to look at
the 50:50 issue by congregation.
• Fairness referred to the equitable sharing of the cost of redress while
reasonableness referred to the manner in which that might be achieved.
• He acknowledged congregations did not bear sole responsibility for abuse and
noted role of the State, the Oireachtas, parents and families, etc.
• He noted that most abuse took place in families.
• He did not believe that media coverage has been fair on congregations.
• He believes that respect can be rebuilt for congregations through responding to the
call for a 50:50 share.
• He confirmed that a number of other management bodies had been written to
seeking contributions. He intended to write to those bodies himself and confirmed
that the list of those bodies would be made available publicly.
The Minister then summarised the position as he saw it: There was general consensus in
regard to the 50:50 issue as long as it was fair to all. Access to appropriate Redress
Board information would facilitate bilateral discussions with congregations which
would explore how matters could be advanced. The aim would be to move close to the
50:50 share.
The meeting then concluded.
7

[jack colleton]

denial is no refuge.  there can be no real and lasting peace in Ireland unless there is first real and lasting justice.